matti
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Posts: 216
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Post by matti on Apr 22, 2007 4:00:35 GMT
Ok, so finally got of my ass and decided I am going to build a 12 x 20 foot (3.7 x 6 meter) Highland house (started prepping the site yesterday) and I was interested to see what everyone Else owns, maybe some outside shots and inside shots and describe what systems you have ect.
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Post by pinglover on Apr 22, 2007 13:11:44 GMT
What's a wet wall?
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Post by maraxas on Apr 22, 2007 13:38:44 GMT
I've heard the term used two ways:
One way is basically an evaporative cooling pad at one end of a greenhouse and the other is a wire mesh, covered in sphagnum and used with a drip system, for plants to climb.
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Post by pinglover on Apr 22, 2007 14:34:03 GMT
OK, thanks. I was thinking more along the lines of what you described as a drip system wall that plants could climb.
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Post by rsivertsen on Apr 22, 2007 15:28:19 GMT
Matti
In your area in Australia, you might be able to grow highland Nepenthes outdoors, in a pit! A few years ago, I had a 20 inch deep pit dug out for a formed concrete slab for a propane and air conditioning unit to be installed. During that summer, I noticed a strange rock in the pit, and when I reached in to grab it, noticed how cool it was down there, although it was nearly 90F where I was standing. I put a few highland Nepenthes in there, and got the best growth from them I’d seen in years! They were N. stenophylla, N. emeyi (N. infundib.) some N. burb, seedlings and a few other misc. highlanders. Unfortunately, I had to pour in the concrete and get the propane tanks delivered by the onset of cooler weather. There is some speculation that ordinary glass is opaque to some of the blue wavelengths in the UV spectrum that may be beneficial to plants. I also got some fantastic growth from the pygmys and tuberous Drosera that year which also grew in that pit!
Longwood Gardens (where money is of little concern, being at least partially funded by the DuPont family), once used refrigerated water to run across the roof glass panes of their cool house, which brought the internal temps down quite a bit. I wound up doing something similar myself, and rediscovered this when I was watering my lawn on a hot and sunny summer day with automatic oscillating lawn sprinklers, and when the cool well water swept across my greenhouse while I was inside, I noticed a fog begin to form from the roof panes and the temps begin to drop very quickly. Several other growers, particularly orchid growers, use large evaporative coolers, or "wet-walls" but add a caveat, they can “inhale” some unwanted insects, and perhaps a screen on the intake manifold would be a good idea.
According to some theories, the rate of respiration is directly related to temperature, while photosynthesis is not; so that many highland plants have a very high rate of respiration, and if it exceeds the rate of photosynthesis, it will go into decline. The trick is to have the rate of photosynthesis exceed the rate of respiration. In some plants, this shift is more critical during the night cycles, and therefore have diurnal thermal shift requirement.
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Post by Michael Catalani on Apr 22, 2007 23:41:43 GMT
Ok, so finally got of my ass and decided I am going to build a 12 x 20 foot (3.7 x 6 meter) Highland house (started prepping the site yesterday) and I was interested to see what everyone Else owns, maybe some outside shots and inside shots and describe what systems you have ect. Dose anyone have any experience with wet walls?. Evaporative coolers are a big help, and in some cases are a must, in order to help lower daytime temps for a highland house. The cooling pads really do two things. First, they can cool the air down to about the temperature of the water over the pads. Second, the air that the exhaust fan brings in through the wet cooling pads will have a higher humidity than without cooling pads. This second point is critical, because if your natural outside humidity is rather low, then you would be replacing warm moist inside air with cool dry outside air. The cool air is good, but the dry air will zap the Nepenthes. Now, if you live in an area that has cool moist outside for most of the year, then an exhaust fan and natural ventilation may be all you need. But if the air is dry, or is rather hot during parts of the year, then cooling pads will help during those times. As far as digging down into the ground, that method works well for greenhouses to help battle summer heat. My friend Carl from East Tennessee did this, and he said it really helps.
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matti
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Posts: 216
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Post by matti on Apr 23, 2007 13:20:48 GMT
Thanks for the help michael, I figured the wet wall would be the best way to do it, just the way it has a surperior design to a small swamp cooler ect, I live in an area that is humid in late summer and VERY HOT and cool in winter (frost) I can grow highlanders in winter no problem ( Grew Nepenthes rajah outside for 2 years)except for the fact I need to keep the humidity up to them, heck it is such a good climbmate here that I am growing Nepenthes spectabilis outside and it looks like it is just starting to form a vine. Anyways I already have a fair bit in my bank account should go up to abit over 700 on wednsday, I know I will need like 2-3 thousand which is no problem, I just need to wait on the bending equipment to arive and check the diamater that the die can take before I start ordering the steel, I am going to build my own steel housing for the wet wall, do you know a good place to purchase the evaporative pads? I have looked around but they seem to mostly be in america.
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matti
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Posts: 216
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Post by matti on Apr 25, 2007 3:43:06 GMT
Never mind, I got my catalog yesterday and the company sells the pads, exhaust fans, fogging fans ect.
So what do your Greenhouses look like then?.
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Post by Michael Catalani on Apr 25, 2007 13:08:10 GMT
Here's a link that shows pictures of my evaporative cooler, vent, and exhaust fan. The greenhouse itself is a 24'x45' Jaderloon. cpjungle.com/nuecool..htm
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Post by vft guy in SJ on Apr 25, 2007 22:08:49 GMT
I have not begun construction yet but I am planning a 10 x 14' GH here. Just the other day I was reading a post from a guy in Melbourne who has a GH that has no cooling system at all.. just a few fans to keep air moving. I dunno where you are in Australia, but maybe you could make that work for you as well? I hope to employ that system for my own GH temp range here is very close to Melbourne.
Are you going to buy a kit or build it yourself from scratch? What materials do you plan to use?
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matti
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Posts: 216
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Post by matti on Apr 26, 2007 7:13:57 GMT
I have not begun construction yet but I am planning a 10 x 14' GH here. Just the other day I was reading a post from a guy in Melbourne who has a GH that has no cooling system at all.. just a few fans to keep air moving. I dunno where you are in Australia, but maybe you could make that work for you as well? I hope to employ that system for my own GH temp range here is very close to Melbourne. Are you going to buy a kit or build it yourself from scratch? What materials do you plan to use? Is that guy Aaron jenkin? I am about half way up the east coast of Australia, near Brisbane. It dose get cool enough here to grow highlanders in winter but the problem is the greenhouse is out in nearly full sun all day and in summer I need a cooling system so I thought the wet wall was the best way to go. I will buy the matterials myself and fabricate the whole thing (Including the wet wall frame, scratch the idear of steel I will use Aluminium), should knock it off in a day to build the frame, matterial will be around 30mm O/D (give or take a few mm) x 1.6 WT gal (steel), the formula to work out the material needed for each hoop is to measure the diamater/width of your greenhouse( 12 feet or 3657mm in my case) then put this into your calculator. TT x 3657 ÷ 2 = 5744mm of steel needed for each hoop (You just have to remember TTx D÷2) I am getting my hands on some bending equipment to bend the hoops, should make life interesting. I hope this post helps you with anything you need, we can compair them/notes as we build!. ;D
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matti
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Posts: 216
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Post by matti on Apr 27, 2007 6:31:11 GMT
Just a quick update I got my bending equipment today, I will have to see if I can get into the metal shop tomorrow. ;D
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matti
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Posts: 216
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Post by matti on Apr 28, 2007 8:52:20 GMT
Ok another update, was at the farm today and remarked the area with some pink spray paint, marked out were the hoops will go and fenced the perimater to keep the cattle and rabbits out. ;D I will try and order the steel on monday.
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matti
Full Member
Posts: 216
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Post by matti on May 2, 2007 10:03:49 GMT
UPDATE: went to metal-corp on Monday and it was shut because I was running late to TAFE, turns out I have to make a stronger fence to keep the cattle out so I will do that this weekend, I will order the steel on Monday if I am early. on a side note has anyone ever noticed how expensive greenhouse equipment is? I got a quote back from a company in victoria and they wanted 1 thousand dollars just for a bloody exhaust fan... I told them were they could shove it , I know I can get them for about 500 from memory up here. I get up at 6 every morning to go to work and go outside to look at my plants, mainly tuberous Drosera, we have a baromater/thermomater/hydromater thingy outside, last couple of days it has been 10c (50f) and 80% humidity, should be good for the Highlanders. ;D
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Post by rsivertsen on May 16, 2007 1:30:20 GMT
matti, according to my experience, the cost of the greenhouse itself is only about a third of the cost of the total, and final system including, excavating for legal, and proper reinforced concrete footings, and foundations, heat, and pure water, hot and cold water outlets with sink, drainage plumbing, and cooling systems, not to mention humidification, proper electrical outlets, and benches, back-up heating, and backup electrical, and emergency notifications of high/low temps alarms, and ventilation fans, ... etc. ... been there, ... done that! welcome to the club!
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