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Post by SundeWCitY on Jul 21, 2007 7:39:14 GMT
I have heard from many books and a few internet sources that n. northiana is a difficult plant to grow, and that spagnum is the worst substrate for the plant. I have been growing mine for a year and it is doing fine in sppagnum. I have also read that they grow on limestone cliffs, has anyone tried adding lime to the plants? ive also read an article in the icps newsletter that using lime in the substrat is beneficial to the plants, what do other growers use as a media for their .northianas?
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Post by phissionkorps on Jul 21, 2007 9:34:34 GMT
Orchid bark/perlite/charcoal/touch of peat. Sphag is a bad idea for Nepenthes in general. Northiana especially needs something different. One of mine is in the above substrate, and the other is in a different kidn of moss (not sphag...don't know specifics on it). The substrate needs to drain quickly and NOT hold a lot of water. Also, you do not need to add lime to the plants. I know of a grower who never used lime and got his plant to flower. If thats not evidence, I dunno what is  |
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Post by Michael Catalani on Jul 21, 2007 17:18:22 GMT
Orchid bark/perlite/charcoal/touch of peat. Sphag is a bad idea for Nepenthes in general. If you are referring to Nepenthes in general, then this is absolutely not true. |
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Clint
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Post by Clint on Jul 21, 2007 18:25:28 GMT
I'd never use peat, and it's cool that you don't like LFS but please don't spread false information. LFS, live or dead, is a fantastic media component. Personally, since I have to be out of town for up to 5 days at a time frequently, I use straight LFS in all my plants. If I used my preferred media (1/1/1 bark/perlite/LFS) they wouldn't last long at all in my absences.
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Post by phissionkorps on Jul 21, 2007 23:04:37 GMT
LFS will lead to problems if you fertilize, has a high rate of "unwanteds" (liverworts, etc) that pop up, overgrows seedlings, gets moldy, compacts thus suffocating roots, and turns to mush quickly (not as fast as coco products, but quickly nonetheless).
There's a reason a LOT of growers stay away from sphag, or use it in very small ratios. There are no benefits from using LFS that cannot be accomplished through the use of another mix.
And I'm not spreading "false information". Like I said, there are a great many reasons for not using it and thus, a ton of growers don't. That's cool that it works for you, but I'd rather take the advice of my personal experiences, and many of the best growers in the US (not including myself in this by any means), instead of knowing that it works for one person. Just because it works doesn't mean its the best.
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Clint
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Post by Clint on Jul 21, 2007 23:43:33 GMT
Ehh, I could refute or justify any example you just gave but I'm not in a mood to argue.
I don't think anything media/mix is the best. It varies from person to person and conditions to conditions.
One this is for sure, you don't need limestone!
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Post by trimen1000 on Jul 23, 2007 23:36:17 GMT
LFS will lead to problems if you fertilize, has a high rate of "unwanteds" (liverworts, etc) that pop up, overgrows seedlings, gets moldy, compacts thus suffocating roots, and turns to mush quickly (not as fast as coco products, but quickly nonetheless). There's a reason a LOT of growers stay away from sphag, or use it in very small ratios. There are no benefits from using LFS that cannot be accomplished through the use of another mix. And I'm not spreading "false information". Like I said, there are a great many reasons for not using it and thus, a ton of growers don't. That's cool that it works for you, but I'd rather take the advice of my personal experiences, and many of the best growers in the US (not including myself in this by any means), instead of knowing that it works for one person. Just because it works doesn't mean its the best. If you fertilize it is true that you need to stay away from LFS. Other than that it's great to use. On the whole matter of if a plant flowers then the plant is doing wonderfully. I had a cutting flower on me. The cutting was still sitting in pure perlite and did not have any roots at all. |
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Post by SundeWCitY on Jul 24, 2007 2:53:11 GMT
if you dont mind me asking why is it not good to use lfs with fertilizer?
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Post by phissionkorps on Jul 24, 2007 3:40:15 GMT
Because the fertilizer breaks it doen and turns it to mush, which smothers the roots and kills the plant.
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Post by Dave Evans on Jul 24, 2007 4:31:24 GMT
Most fertilizer is salt with nutrients added. Also, most of the nutrients are actually in a salt format. Sphagnum is not a fan of salt. A little fertilizer is Kay, but it is easy to over do it. I have found using fertilizer can be useful in very low amounts and when used as a flair feed, but it is far better to feed using insects so you do not damage the soil and plants with salt and the results seem to indicate the plants get more useful material from the insects, growing quicker and displaying darker shades of green, with deeper red coloration as well than when salty fertilizer is used.
Also, N. northing is an intermediate altitude plant. It will grow better when given cooling temperatures at night. Like N. cleat it gets warm or even hot during the day, but cools off substantially at night.
You can add small amounts of limestone to your mix, but I have no idea what it would do to living Sphagnum... The plants I have in limestone amended soil are: N. boschiana and N. campanulata. They grow great in it, much better than the more standard Nepenthes soil their previous growers had them in. I have used two types of limestone, one is the kind used to make white lines (pure Ca) on the playing fields for sports and the other was a limestone made of 50% Ca and 50% Ma which was in the form of small, rounded pellets reddish brown in color; these pellets/balls sort of melted after I mixed them with organic (acidic) material I use in my soil.
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Post by SundeWCitY on Jul 24, 2007 4:55:41 GMT
thats good to know thanks very much! also, has anyone had sucess with using superthrive on cps? i have been using lately but i canot tell if it has been beneficial..
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Post by Michael Catalani on Jul 24, 2007 5:04:41 GMT
Because the fertilizer breaks it doen and turns it to mush, which smothers the roots and kills the plant. It sounds like you are referring to living long fiber sphagnum. And as far as fertilizing is concerned, living lfs doesnt like fertilizer and can end up with some issues you described above. I dont fertilize my Neps. I've experimented with different types of fertilizers in the past, but the plants seem to grow well without them. Back when I was in full operation with the CP Jungle, there were about 6 species that caused me headaches by growing too quickly even without fertilizers. You wont have these types of problems with non living lfs. It will break down over time and become stringy, but it doesnt turn to mush. It hasnt for me at least. A big advantage of lfs in a larger greenhouse is its ability to raise the local humidity around the plants by storing vast amounts of moisture. Other soils can also do this, but not nearly to the same degree as lfs. In my large greenhouse, its not unusual for the relative humidity to drop below 50% at times during the day. But the plants pots are located on thin beds of wet lfs, and this keeps the local humidity around the plants higher, which helps in pitcher production. For those of us that can use tap water, it is often best to water less frequently so that salts dont build up. I would have to water my plants about 3 times per day during the summer with a media that contains little or no lfs. You simply cannot keep the humidity in a large greenhouse high enough during the summer in my area not to cause an open media to dry out, like those based on orchid bark. Special mixes can work great in smaller greenhouses and chambers where the humidity can be kept constantly high, but in a larger greenhouse in my area I would have to water so frequently that I could end up having a problem with salt buildup. As far as beginners with nepenthes are concerned, it is much easier to start off by using lfs as a medium, and then moving to a more specialized mix than to start off with a really open mix. |
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Post by phissionkorps on Jul 24, 2007 10:05:57 GMT
Regardless of my feelings and experiences with LFS, I agree with this. For most of the "beginner" plants, LFS will at the very least get the job done. I like to mix things up though, and I do tend to have some species that I feel require specific soils or mixes.
Northiana is one of those species though. There is no doubt it needs and extremely quickly draining soil, and sphag does not suffice in this case.
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