Drained terrarium

[Hermopolis]

Hi,

I'm converting my 55g salt water aquarium into a Potted-Landscaped CP terrarium. I am familiar with the general care of CP's, but I had an esoteric terrarium design question that I wanted to present to the real experts.

Would there be any benefit to drilling a drainage hole in the bottom of the terrarium with a valve? The purpose of this would be to occasionally drain off mineral-ladened water, so that minerals would not concentrate in the substrate. I am already using RO water so I don't expect a large amount of mineral buildup but I have read that a Landscaped terrarium needs to be torn up because of mineral buildup/substrate degradation. Could the need to replace substrate be effectively delayed if the terrarium was in fact an open system?

Your comments on this would be appreciated.

Thanks,

Imhotep.

[rsivertsen]

Hey Imhotep, I use those terrariums just the way they are with a film of water on the bottom to keep the humidity high, and keep it covered on top. I use some florescent grates from my local home improvement center on top of a few 4 inch pots for elevation, to keep the pots from having their feet in standing water. I use a siphon tube to drain out the excess water when it gets too deep, or I just pull out the pots, and drag the entire empty tank outside on my deck and blast it clean with my garden hose. This set-up is ideal for rooting cuttings and raising seedlings. - Rich

[Hermopolis]

Well, while I do enjoy the plants on their own merits, I also wish to have, let's just say, a more finished look to the terrarium. I also don't have the luxury of tearing it apart and taking it to a back yard and hosing it out, since I live in an appartment.

Nevertheless, the question is "does standing water in a terrarium eventually lead to substrate degradation because of the accumulation of minerals?" And would draining the water occasionally improve the longevity of the substrate? I'm not suggesting draining it dry. I'm suggesting that once in a while the standing water might be drained out, and replaced with fresh RO water. I guess I would like to know if there is any point to putting a drain in my terrarium to do this.

Thanks,

-Imhotep

[rsivertsen]

I've found that setting up a terrarium, with all the plants planted all together in a display looks great for about a year or so, but long term, just doesn't work well. Eventually the plants, especially Nepenthes, will outgrow them, and need to be re potted, and then you have to deal with their roots growing all over the place. The other problem is that if any bugs, get in there, it's next to impossible to get rid of them, or to treat any fungal and/or bacterial disease. Any organic compost will eventually begin to break down and rot. Also, the salt accumulation on the surface is a constant problem.

In a terrarium with potted plants, that allow drainage, the biggest hassle is to pull out the pots, re pot them if necessary, drag the empty tank into the shower of bathtub if you have to and rinse it out, or just use a bunch of paper towels to overhaul it about once or twice a year, and put the plants back in again. - Rich

[Hermopolis]

Aug 16, 2009 14:33:07 GMT rsivertsen said:

I've found that setting up a terrarium, with all the plants planted all together in a display looks great for about a year or so, but long term, just doesn't work well. Eventually the plants, especially Nepenthes, will outgrow them, and need to be re potted, and then you have to deal with their roots growing all over the place.

Perhaps I didn't make myself clear. I am intending upon a potted-landscaped terrarium. This means that the plants will be in pots within a landscaped terrarium. This way I can remove the plants for repotting without problems.

The other problem is that if any bugs, get in there, it's next to impossible to get rid of them, or to treat any fungal and/or bacterial disease. Any organic compost will eventually begin to break down and rot. Also, the salt accumulation on the surface is a constant problem.

I grant all that which is why the question regarding a drained system. If there are bugs or fungus, remove the plants and treat with fungicides/systemic insecticides. Then drain and rinse. Again with salt accumulation, it struck me that a drained system with top watering could control salt accumulation. Hence, the question.

In a terrarium with potted plants, that allow drainage, the biggest hassle is to pull out the pots, re pot them if necessary, drag the empty tank into the shower of bathtub if you have to and rinse it out, or just use a bunch of paper towels to overhaul it about once or twice a year, and put the plants back in again. - Rich

This does not work so well with a 55 gal tank. I'd rather avoid the problems to begin with. Hence, the question...

-Imhotep.

[williamg]

Here is my .02 cents. So, the plants will be in pots in a terrarium. Then the pots will be covered with soil so you can't see the pots and made to look natural. If this is your set up, they why are you worrying about mineral build up? The build up will only matter in the pots, which you can replace in the soil. Saying that, building a drain into the tank would be a OK idea, because the excess water from the pots could be drained out, keeping the covering medium dry and fungus/rot/nasty stuff free. It depends on what you are using. But in all probability, you will have to replace the medium at some time. However, be careful with what plants you put in, or you might have the problem this guy had. icps.proboards.com/index.cgi?board=nepenthes&action=display&thread=2698
Correct me if I am wrong, and hope this helps
Williamg

[Hermopolis]

Aug 17, 2009 17:15:46 GMT williamg said:

Here is my .02 cents. So, the plants will be in pots in a terrarium. Then the pots will be covered with soil so you can't see the pots and made to look natural.

Yes, precisely. I know a lot of people enjoy the laboratory feel of potted plants in a bare-bottom terrarium; however, I have always found it aesthetically unappealing. Yet, I also see the wisdom of confining each plant to its own pot.

A little sand covered pool foam on the rims of the larger plastic pots, plus some rock held together with tie-wraps and marine epoxy, plus terracing with florescent light grating and covered with a few inches of sphagnum peat and sand with a top covering of live sphagnum moss, and you have a landscape job your mother would be proud of. ;D Maybe even a small fountain cascading down the rock face to keep the humidity high. And each plant happily in its own pot.

If this is your set up, they why are you worrying about mineral build up?

I am somewhat concerned because (a) the more boggy plants, e.g. the utricularia, will be sharing the water supply with the substrate even though they will be potted, and (b) mineral build up looks unsightly on live sphagnum.

Saying that, building a drain into the tank would be a OK idea, because the excess water from the pots could be drained out, keeping the covering medium dry and fungus/rot/nasty stuff free.

Fungus and nasty stuffy was also a concern.

It depends on what you are using. But in all probability, you will have to replace the medium at some time. However, be careful with what plants you put in, or you might have the problem this guy had.

I don't intend to plant anything directly into the substrate except for live sphagnum moss. Now, if a volunteer jumps the pot and establishes itself in the substrate, then it is fair game if and when I do replace the substrate. I do recognize that I will eventually have to replace the substrate, but why do it sooner than is necessary?

icps.proboards.com/index.cgi?board=nepenthes&action=display&thread=2698
Correct me if I am wrong, and hope this helps
Williamg

Of course, I have to wonder about the wisdom of planting n. bicalcarata in a 18" tall terrarium even with adequate containment. The guy had 9 nepenthes all directly planted into the substrate of a 50g terrarium. Common sense should apply.

Thanks, your reply was helpful.

[williamg]

Your welcome. Let us know how it works outs.
Good Luck,
Williamg

[taz6122]

I wouldn't use a valve because it would eventually get stuck open due to soil or corrosion. A plug would suffice.

[Hermopolis]

Thanks for the suggestion.

I am planning a 1.5 to 2 inch drain. I had thought of using a valve, but you are probably correct that a plug would be a better choice.

I will be posting pictures as I build the terrarium.


-Hermes.