kby
Full Member
Posts: 162
|
Post by kby on Jun 17, 2008 5:21:35 GMT
This is my decade (I think) old H. heterodoxa, and it's flowered at least a couple of times before. I think I mentioned in another thread somewhere I thought it might be flowering again. Then it looked more like a crown was dividing (which I am probably more interested in but is less exciting). Turns out, there are two leaves, but the one I thought was going to be a flower really is a leaf (at least so it seems so far), but the one I thought was a leaf, is actually a bract pitcher; this is the first time I've actually seen this behaviour (had only heard about it after reading McPherson's book): (noting the long stem on the bottom and what looks like an exceptionally wide ala). The flower itself is not yet visible in this picture but can be easily seen & discerned if the bract is backlighted strongly enough-kby
|
|
|
Post by Brian Barnes on Jun 18, 2008 2:15:10 GMT
Very interesting post indeed, Kby. My Heliamphora heterodoxa x minor is flowering, with the pod about to open any day now and I'm experiencing almost the same thing... Along with the fully developed flower spike, I noticed what looked like a combination between a flower spike and a pitcher coming up amongst the pitchers. It's long like a blade of grass, but has a slight ala and what appeared to be a slight nectar spoon. At first glance, I thought it was a Lobelia hitchhiker. After consulting several botanical references, that is not the case. This leaf emerged semi-folded in half, then opened. Come to find out, it is a Pogonia. ;D Happy Growing, Brian.
|
|
kby
Full Member
Posts: 162
|
Post by kby on Jun 18, 2008 17:55:06 GMT
Nice pics, Brian. I assume the first two photos and the thing that looks like a primitive pitcher in the lower right corner of the third are of the same thing? I've not seen anything like that but it sure looks like a "proto-pitcher" in the third one if I've identified things correctly. You'll need to get François' opinion on that one! The last pic looks just like the top of the flower stalk, though, right? Or am I confused.-kby
|
|
|
Post by Brian Barnes on Jun 19, 2008 10:35:58 GMT
Hey kby, The strange "leaf" is actually a Pogonia! How it got there, I'll never know... Brian.
|
|
kby
Full Member
Posts: 162
|
Post by kby on Jun 19, 2008 20:50:27 GMT
But (at least in the third picture it looks carnivorous:-)!-kby
|
|
kby
Full Member
Posts: 162
|
Post by kby on Aug 2, 2008 23:13:44 GMT
|
|
|
Post by echosaisis on Aug 6, 2008 15:41:13 GMT
right out of alice in wonderland!
|
|
|
Post by Dave Evans on Aug 6, 2008 21:53:14 GMT
Hey kby, The strange "leaf" is actually a Pogonia! How it got there, I'll never know... Brian. Answer: seed.
|
|
|
Post by Sockhom on Aug 25, 2008 20:21:24 GMT
Hello ! Interesting post! Bract pitcher seem to appear on a regular basis in the field. I got a nice one on my H. heterodoxa x ionasii last year. By the way, Kby, is your last plant supposed to be a regular H. heterodoxa? Because it really looks like a H. heterodoxa x ionasii to me! H. heterodoxa 's got a bigger lid and it shouldn't be as infundibulate. Just my opinion. François.
|
|
kby
Full Member
Posts: 162
|
Post by kby on Aug 25, 2008 21:22:14 GMT
Hi François,
Thanks for providing the observations of the master (I always look at your posts and drool)!
Well, it was ordered as a regular hetrodoxa from Wistuba, but that was about 10+ years ago...usually I think of his labelling as pretty good, though. It is supposed to be the Gran Sabana form and not the Ptari Tepui (type) variety.
Nice to know the bracht pitchers are not that uncommon. McPherson said "randomly in the field" or something like that and his is the only book I'd seen them in.
-Kimo B . Yap
|
|
|
Post by Sockhom on Aug 26, 2008 3:34:38 GMT
Thanks for providing the observations of the master (I always look at your posts and drool)! Thanks. But I'm no master. When it comes to Heliamphora, some german friends can really be called "seasoned growers". Like Mathias: www.cpukforum.com/forum/index.php?showtopic=27207&hl=matthiasBy the way, you should send a picture to Wistuba. I'm sure he'll take the time to ID your plant. If my memory serves me right, Andreas was the one who created the hybrid H. heterododa x ionasii. François.
|
|
kby
Full Member
Posts: 162
|
Post by kby on Aug 26, 2008 18:36:20 GMT
Thanks for the suggestion; I'll have to do that. I'm not as sensitive to the infundibular (or lack thereof) nature of the top so much, and I always figured the smaller spoons were an artifact of my cultural conditions.-kby
|
|
|
Post by Dave Evans on Aug 26, 2008 22:21:18 GMT
Dear Brian,
I also doubt the ID of H. heterodoxa. But Heliamphora are quite an odd group with individuals showing a lot of diversity within each species, despite some having very little habitat.
It seems odd to me how similar all Heliamphora are to each other, yet the various species of Sarrracenia are very easy to tell apart, the only ones which seem to give people some trouble are S. purpurea vs. S. rosea...
|
|
|
Post by stevestewart on Aug 26, 2008 22:39:22 GMT
Dear Brian, I also doubt the ID of H. heterodoxa. But Heliamphora are quite an odd group with individuals showing a lot of diversity within each species, despite some having very little habitat. It seems odd to me how similar all Heliamphora are to each other, yet the various species of Sarrracenia are very easy to tell apart, the only ones which seem to give people some trouble are S. purpurea vs. S. rosea... Dave, It's off topic in this category, but a few people might lump plants once known as the S. rubra complex, as having similar traits as well. (without plant nursery labels at least) Take care, Steven Stewart
|
|
|
Post by Sockhom on Aug 27, 2008 8:39:25 GMT
Hello ! I still have a hell of trouble to distinguish some S. alata from some rubra! But, Steve is right... This is for another topic ;D. When it comes to Heliamphora taxonomy, the structure of the appendage (the "spoon") is very important. Heliamphora heterodoxa can be distinguished from the others thanks to the following points: - pitchers proportionately elongated (only slightly infundibular in the lower section for the type form from Ptari Tepui); - Pitcher opening narrow; - Short downward pointing hairs in the inner surface; - large and red nectar spoon Remember that the green form spread in cultivation isn't described. The type form is the reddish H. heterodoxa from Ptari Tepui. KBY, if your "heterodoxa" nectar spoons were very small, I would have said that your plant was not grown under good conditions but it does look really fine... and seems to not fit heterodoxa description. As a matter of fact, my H. heterodoxa x ionasii is identical to yours. I will take pictures of both my H. heterodoxa and my H. heterodoxa x ionasii when I can. François.
|
|